This 70-year-old woman appreciates your thoughts here. I've been following Letters With My Father for a bit and have to admit some envy for the respectful and thoughtful discourse you create. As a person who was raised in a Christian church and then raised my own children in an even more fundamental atmosphere, I now struggle with so many things that I forced on them. Substack and letters like yours have awakened things in me that I did not feel free to explore. I'm better for it. I hope that my children can see in me what I believe your son sees in you: a partner in understanding, hope, and a resolve to make things better, one step and word at a time. Thank you.
Thank you so much Donna. It was a long journey for me as well. It took a while for me to treat him and other people with humility. I was very dogmatic in my approach. That attitude has turned so many people off. I just want a good exchange of ideas
Donna thank you so much for writing this. Our newsletter isn’t getting millions of views per month, but I really believe in what we’re doing here. It’s worth it even if just one person gets something out of this project. Thank you for the wonderful comment.
I am not sure what you are doing. So what is your advice on how do we heal? The question raised in the headline is not answered or do you say it is impossible. I have no idea what you think we should do or what will happen. I am a little more linear than that. God's word tells us Christ will return and unite his people. Some believe we will usher in Christ's return and all people will eventually be Christians. The whole thing is split into camps. When this happens I believe it means that the subject is not meant to have a concrete answer but it is to reflect on. There is plenty of material in the Bible that tells us some people are lost eternally.. (kinda like Hillary's irredeemables:) Romans 1:23..."so he gave them over to a reprobate mind." He has seen they won't change so he let's them keep digging themselves a deeper hole.
The wheat is separated from the chaff. Our works aren't what Christ will be looking for. He looks for faith and knows who has it. Ephesians 2:8-9. We are saved by faith alone. Also (John 3:16) If we were all true believers, the world would be heaven. That will only happen because he will do that. And he won't do it by coverting Muslims, Atheists and Hindus. Most of them are unreachable. That doesn't mean we shouldn't share Christ with them, because we don't know who may have a seed of the spirit influencing them. They are not congruent with Christianity in any way in their current state.
We do desire to be with our own kind. The Zebras aren't over hangin' with the Giraffes. We want fellowship with other believers. That is what it means to be with one another and have fellowhsip. It does not include atheists and religions that are an afront to Christ. It's not that those people can't come to Christ, it is that we know they for pratical purposes, will not. "Narrow is the path.." We are not here to have harmony with everyone. Christ said his coming won't bring peace! That is true. Matthew 10:34-36. He said, “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. And a person's enemies will be those of his own household." And of course our enemies will be anyone who does not know Christ. In worldly terms that does not mean we cannot enjoy being with other people.
It may be that your definition of a Christian is expanded by adding those that try to be kind and be helping to other people, but don't acknowledge the source of that desire to be anything but Christ. We Giraffes will be okay if we hang out together and let the Lions and Jackals hang together too. But they are not us. We are his people. Either you are a saint or an a'int. It really is that simple. If you think people can become Christians if they are automatically helping others is salvation by works. If I were you I would ask me: "Are you a Calvinist?" No, I am surely not.
Hello Craig and thank you for your response. Let me try to navigate through your response by addressing your concerns at certain points
I am not sure what you are doing. So what is your advice on how do we heal? The question raised in the headline is not answered or do you say it is impossible.
MY RESPONSE- That’s a valid point. The main thing I’m trying to do is disarm both sides from the sanctimonious attitudes we have with each other. What I’m saying is let’s remove that attitude on both sides and then have a discussion on why we have come to the conclusions we have to live the way we live. I’m trying to show in my letters that we all come to a worldview in our journey through life and that if a person has a different view, it doesn’t mean they’re evil. So, I’m saying taking the judgmental and sanctimonious attitude out of it is going to greatly strengthen the communication, we’re not going to close the gap with each other with the present attitude.
I’m saying to agreeing to disagree goes a long way to bring people together. We’ve lost that in America big time whether it is politics or religion. I prefer Martin Luther’s strategy. He had round table discussions with his students. It was a totally open forum where any topic was discussed.
I have no idea what you think we should do or what will happen.
MY RESPONSE- Again, let’s try to open a discussion with each other and give reasons for our beliefs. Let people give reasons for why we have come to our conclusions and have an open discussion. I prefer the power of persuasion in an atmosphere of a good exchange of ideas where no one feels brow beat. I’m not talking about a church setting either. I’m talking about the setting we’re on right now or maybe even a neighborhood of people getting together in a setting where they feel at ease to discuss or challenge any belief or view on any topic. Maybe when we all see the type of people we are in that context it will take the hostility out of the equation. Let’s have each other over our homes, let’s have fellowship time where we get to know each other and build a friendship. Then maybe good things will follow. Communication is the key. Good communication without either side getting defensive.
I am a little more linear than that. God's word tells us Christ will return and unite his people. Some believe we will usher in Christ's return and all people will eventually be Christians. The whole thing is split into camps. When this happens I believe it means that the subject is not meant to have a concrete answer but it is to reflect on. There is plenty of material in the Bible that tells us some people are lost eternally.. (kinda like Hillary's irredeemables:) Romans 1:23..."so he gave them over to a reprobate mind." He has seen they won't change so he let's them keep digging themselves a deeper hole.
MY RESPONSE- Until that happens, I’m addressing the tactics we as Christians can use. We all may have differing views on that and that’s OK. I’m saying my tactic will be an open discussion where I won’t get defensive and listen to people that may not see it the way I do. If they have a question as to where a belief I have may take me to an uncomfortable conclusion they can ask me. But I’ll do it in love.
The wheat is separated from the chaff. Our works aren't what Christ will be looking for. He looks for faith and knows who has it. Ephesians 2:8-9. We are saved by faith alone. Also (John 3:16) If we were all true believers, the world would be heaven. That will only happen because he will do that. And he won't do it by coverting Muslims, Atheists and Hindus. Most of them are unreachable. That doesn't mean we shouldn't share Christ with them, because we don't know who may have a seed of the spirit influencing them. They are not congruent with Christianity in any way in their current state.
MY RESPONSE- This letter wasn’t primarily a letter on proselytizing. It was more a letter to discuss the divide in America. Are there religious questions that will ultimately be addressed? Yes. And I’m trying to lead the discussion that way by taking some of the more popular beliefs on absolute truth and moral relativism and questioning it in a way that leads to a good discussion. I was trying to show in my previous letter that all of us come a worldview based on something. And when we start adding the do’s and don’ts, we are stepping out of subjective views into objective views, Well, this leads to a good discussion about the very nature of truth, It can really only lead to a discussion about theism, and then ultimately about the truth claims of Christianity.
We do desire to be with our own kind. The Zebras aren't over hangin' with the Giraffes. We want fellowship with other believers. That is what it means to be with one another and have fellowhsip. It does not include atheists and religions that are an afront to Christ. It's not that those people can't come to Christ, it is that we know they for pratical purposes, will not.
MY RESPONSE- I don’t hold to the fortress mentality. I’ve been there and done that. I prefer the restoration mentality by engaging with everyone. In the context of that comment about tribalism I was more talking about separation by race. And while we’re on that topic the Christian church, I hate to admit this especially the church with white Christians has done much harm. My church isn’t that way at all. Many churches aren’t. But many still are.
"Narrow is the path.." We are not here to have harmony with everyone. Christ said his coming won't bring peace! That is true. Matthew 10:34-36. He said, “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. And a person's enemies will be those of his own household." And of course our enemies will be anyone who does not know Christ. In worldly terms that does not mean we cannot enjoy being with other people.
MY RESPIONSE- Again, my desire is attempting to open a dialogue in this culture we’re in. There was a time in America that those with differing views could co-exist in society without all this anger. There are so many areas where the church could improve. Read some of my letters and you’ll see I by no means compromise my beliefs.
It may be that your definition of a Christian is expanded by adding those that try to be kind and be helping to other people, but don't acknowledge the source of that desire to be anything but Christ. We Giraffes will be okay if we hang out together and let the Lions and Jackals hang together too.
MY RESPONSE- You wouldn’t have friends that aren’t Christians? Did Jesus sit down with everyone?
But they are not us. We are his people. Either you are a saint or an a'int. It really is that simple. If you think people can become Christians if they are automatically helping others is salvation by works.
MY RESPONSE- Did I ever say that? No. I’m simply making a point that people with different views can help their fellow man. If that opens a dialogue that’s the whole point. It’s the attitude towards the church and people with differing views I’m trying to address.
If I were you I would ask me: "Are you a Calvinist?" No, I am surely not.
Craig, thanks for the like on my Dad's article. I'm going to take a little heat here and tell you that I wrote my Dad's headline for him and ran it by him before publishing. I thought he wrote enough to justify what the headline says, but maybe I was wrong. Thanks for being a reader of ours. It's cool to see people engaging with our work so much!
This 70-year-old woman appreciates your thoughts here. I've been following Letters With My Father for a bit and have to admit some envy for the respectful and thoughtful discourse you create. As a person who was raised in a Christian church and then raised my own children in an even more fundamental atmosphere, I now struggle with so many things that I forced on them. Substack and letters like yours have awakened things in me that I did not feel free to explore. I'm better for it. I hope that my children can see in me what I believe your son sees in you: a partner in understanding, hope, and a resolve to make things better, one step and word at a time. Thank you.
Thank you so much Donna. It was a long journey for me as well. It took a while for me to treat him and other people with humility. I was very dogmatic in my approach. That attitude has turned so many people off. I just want a good exchange of ideas
Donna thank you so much for writing this. Our newsletter isn’t getting millions of views per month, but I really believe in what we’re doing here. It’s worth it even if just one person gets something out of this project. Thank you for the wonderful comment.
What you two are doing here is so incredible! Thank you.
Thank you so much Heidy. We're so glad you're part of the family!!
I am not sure what you are doing. So what is your advice on how do we heal? The question raised in the headline is not answered or do you say it is impossible. I have no idea what you think we should do or what will happen. I am a little more linear than that. God's word tells us Christ will return and unite his people. Some believe we will usher in Christ's return and all people will eventually be Christians. The whole thing is split into camps. When this happens I believe it means that the subject is not meant to have a concrete answer but it is to reflect on. There is plenty of material in the Bible that tells us some people are lost eternally.. (kinda like Hillary's irredeemables:) Romans 1:23..."so he gave them over to a reprobate mind." He has seen they won't change so he let's them keep digging themselves a deeper hole.
The wheat is separated from the chaff. Our works aren't what Christ will be looking for. He looks for faith and knows who has it. Ephesians 2:8-9. We are saved by faith alone. Also (John 3:16) If we were all true believers, the world would be heaven. That will only happen because he will do that. And he won't do it by coverting Muslims, Atheists and Hindus. Most of them are unreachable. That doesn't mean we shouldn't share Christ with them, because we don't know who may have a seed of the spirit influencing them. They are not congruent with Christianity in any way in their current state.
We do desire to be with our own kind. The Zebras aren't over hangin' with the Giraffes. We want fellowship with other believers. That is what it means to be with one another and have fellowhsip. It does not include atheists and religions that are an afront to Christ. It's not that those people can't come to Christ, it is that we know they for pratical purposes, will not. "Narrow is the path.." We are not here to have harmony with everyone. Christ said his coming won't bring peace! That is true. Matthew 10:34-36. He said, “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. And a person's enemies will be those of his own household." And of course our enemies will be anyone who does not know Christ. In worldly terms that does not mean we cannot enjoy being with other people.
It may be that your definition of a Christian is expanded by adding those that try to be kind and be helping to other people, but don't acknowledge the source of that desire to be anything but Christ. We Giraffes will be okay if we hang out together and let the Lions and Jackals hang together too. But they are not us. We are his people. Either you are a saint or an a'int. It really is that simple. If you think people can become Christians if they are automatically helping others is salvation by works. If I were you I would ask me: "Are you a Calvinist?" No, I am surely not.
Hello Craig and thank you for your response. Let me try to navigate through your response by addressing your concerns at certain points
I am not sure what you are doing. So what is your advice on how do we heal? The question raised in the headline is not answered or do you say it is impossible.
MY RESPONSE- That’s a valid point. The main thing I’m trying to do is disarm both sides from the sanctimonious attitudes we have with each other. What I’m saying is let’s remove that attitude on both sides and then have a discussion on why we have come to the conclusions we have to live the way we live. I’m trying to show in my letters that we all come to a worldview in our journey through life and that if a person has a different view, it doesn’t mean they’re evil. So, I’m saying taking the judgmental and sanctimonious attitude out of it is going to greatly strengthen the communication, we’re not going to close the gap with each other with the present attitude.
I’m saying to agreeing to disagree goes a long way to bring people together. We’ve lost that in America big time whether it is politics or religion. I prefer Martin Luther’s strategy. He had round table discussions with his students. It was a totally open forum where any topic was discussed.
I have no idea what you think we should do or what will happen.
MY RESPONSE- Again, let’s try to open a discussion with each other and give reasons for our beliefs. Let people give reasons for why we have come to our conclusions and have an open discussion. I prefer the power of persuasion in an atmosphere of a good exchange of ideas where no one feels brow beat. I’m not talking about a church setting either. I’m talking about the setting we’re on right now or maybe even a neighborhood of people getting together in a setting where they feel at ease to discuss or challenge any belief or view on any topic. Maybe when we all see the type of people we are in that context it will take the hostility out of the equation. Let’s have each other over our homes, let’s have fellowship time where we get to know each other and build a friendship. Then maybe good things will follow. Communication is the key. Good communication without either side getting defensive.
I am a little more linear than that. God's word tells us Christ will return and unite his people. Some believe we will usher in Christ's return and all people will eventually be Christians. The whole thing is split into camps. When this happens I believe it means that the subject is not meant to have a concrete answer but it is to reflect on. There is plenty of material in the Bible that tells us some people are lost eternally.. (kinda like Hillary's irredeemables:) Romans 1:23..."so he gave them over to a reprobate mind." He has seen they won't change so he let's them keep digging themselves a deeper hole.
MY RESPONSE- Until that happens, I’m addressing the tactics we as Christians can use. We all may have differing views on that and that’s OK. I’m saying my tactic will be an open discussion where I won’t get defensive and listen to people that may not see it the way I do. If they have a question as to where a belief I have may take me to an uncomfortable conclusion they can ask me. But I’ll do it in love.
The wheat is separated from the chaff. Our works aren't what Christ will be looking for. He looks for faith and knows who has it. Ephesians 2:8-9. We are saved by faith alone. Also (John 3:16) If we were all true believers, the world would be heaven. That will only happen because he will do that. And he won't do it by coverting Muslims, Atheists and Hindus. Most of them are unreachable. That doesn't mean we shouldn't share Christ with them, because we don't know who may have a seed of the spirit influencing them. They are not congruent with Christianity in any way in their current state.
MY RESPONSE- This letter wasn’t primarily a letter on proselytizing. It was more a letter to discuss the divide in America. Are there religious questions that will ultimately be addressed? Yes. And I’m trying to lead the discussion that way by taking some of the more popular beliefs on absolute truth and moral relativism and questioning it in a way that leads to a good discussion. I was trying to show in my previous letter that all of us come a worldview based on something. And when we start adding the do’s and don’ts, we are stepping out of subjective views into objective views, Well, this leads to a good discussion about the very nature of truth, It can really only lead to a discussion about theism, and then ultimately about the truth claims of Christianity.
We do desire to be with our own kind. The Zebras aren't over hangin' with the Giraffes. We want fellowship with other believers. That is what it means to be with one another and have fellowhsip. It does not include atheists and religions that are an afront to Christ. It's not that those people can't come to Christ, it is that we know they for pratical purposes, will not.
MY RESPONSE- I don’t hold to the fortress mentality. I’ve been there and done that. I prefer the restoration mentality by engaging with everyone. In the context of that comment about tribalism I was more talking about separation by race. And while we’re on that topic the Christian church, I hate to admit this especially the church with white Christians has done much harm. My church isn’t that way at all. Many churches aren’t. But many still are.
"Narrow is the path.." We are not here to have harmony with everyone. Christ said his coming won't bring peace! That is true. Matthew 10:34-36. He said, “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law. And a person's enemies will be those of his own household." And of course our enemies will be anyone who does not know Christ. In worldly terms that does not mean we cannot enjoy being with other people.
MY RESPIONSE- Again, my desire is attempting to open a dialogue in this culture we’re in. There was a time in America that those with differing views could co-exist in society without all this anger. There are so many areas where the church could improve. Read some of my letters and you’ll see I by no means compromise my beliefs.
It may be that your definition of a Christian is expanded by adding those that try to be kind and be helping to other people, but don't acknowledge the source of that desire to be anything but Christ. We Giraffes will be okay if we hang out together and let the Lions and Jackals hang together too.
MY RESPONSE- You wouldn’t have friends that aren’t Christians? Did Jesus sit down with everyone?
But they are not us. We are his people. Either you are a saint or an a'int. It really is that simple. If you think people can become Christians if they are automatically helping others is salvation by works.
MY RESPONSE- Did I ever say that? No. I’m simply making a point that people with different views can help their fellow man. If that opens a dialogue that’s the whole point. It’s the attitude towards the church and people with differing views I’m trying to address.
If I were you I would ask me: "Are you a Calvinist?" No, I am surely not.
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Craig, thanks for the like on my Dad's article. I'm going to take a little heat here and tell you that I wrote my Dad's headline for him and ran it by him before publishing. I thought he wrote enough to justify what the headline says, but maybe I was wrong. Thanks for being a reader of ours. It's cool to see people engaging with our work so much!